Elevating Your Home Builder Sales Team - Brook Jennings

Greg Bray: And we are pleased today to have joining us on the show Brook Jennings. Brook is the founder at Elevate Actually. Welcome, Brook. Thanks for spending time with us today.

Brook Jennings: Thank you so much. I'm honored to be here.

Greg Bray: Well, let's start out by just helping folks get to know you. Give us that background and overview about yourself.

Brook Jennings: Yeah. I [00:01:00] am the founder, as you said, of Elevate Actually. I'm a sales trainer. I love salespeople. I find myself to be quite obsessed with the gap in between learning, that education piece, and execution, that actual doing piece.

Kevin Weitzel: Well, Brooke, before we get started in learning more about what you do, could you please give our listeners some interesting factoid about yourself that has nothing to do with family, the home building industry, or work in general?

Brook Jennings: My favorite meal, out of all of the delicious things I have eaten, is a Waffle House waffle. Eating a Waffle House waffle is a religious experience, and I'm always thinking about it. Actually, I'm thinking about it right now, and I'm just a lover of the Waffle House.

Kevin Weitzel: Obviously, people that know my body type, know that I'm a professional eater, in addition to other things that I've done professionally. I can tell you that I too share your Waffle House experience joy. However, if you ever make it to Arizona, I'm going to give a plug to this restaurant.

Brook Jennings: [00:02:00] Okay.

Kevin Weitzel: And it's called Over Easy. They have this thing called the molten waffle, and what it is is a waffle that is made with their own special sauce, and it has malt mix in it. And it is so ridiculously delicious-

Brook Jennings: Oh, my gosh. I get it.

Kevin Weitzel: That you might change your religion over it.

Brook Jennings: Okay. Well, I will be going to Arizona early next year, and I'm going to text you, and I'm going to make sure that I haul myself to that place.

Kevin Weitzel: I'll even parlay it to even elevate it, and Greg and I will treat you to an experience at Over Easy. We will treat you, whether we can join you or not, or whether I can join you or not, 'cause Greg's on the other side of the planet. He's over in Georgia. I will treat you to Over Easy Waffle on OutHouse and Blue Tangerine.

Brook Jennings: Okay. That is happening. I can't wait. I'm so excited, 'cause then maybe my new answer will be the molten waffle.

Kevin Weitzel: I'm telling you right now, it is ridiculous. Anyway, so let's get back to what we're here for.

Greg Bray: I was just saying, now a word from our sponsor, Waffle [00:03:00] House.

Brook Jennings: Listen. Yeah. That's my dream sponsorship, actually.

Greg Bray: Well, Brook, tell us a little bit more about your company, the kinds of things you guys are offering, and who you're working with today.

Brook Jennings: Yeah. So, we work with home builders and also lenders, and a lot of on-your-lot builders, which is really awesome. I just want to help salespeople actually get better. I started in the new home industry as a sales assistant, and I just fell in love, absolute in love with sales, and what a gift it is, and such a service. And so I work with a lot of salespeople. And I have Abby Cornelius on the Elevate Actually team, and she works with sales leaders. So, we got the sales strategies, and then we have the sales leadership tools as well.

Greg Bray: So, you've been doing some sales training for a little while now, and a lot of builders spend a lot of time and money on trying to teach and train and everything else. Like all of us, we're not always open to, oh, I got another training meeting. [00:04:00] Here we go again. I'm just going to sit here and check the box that I showed up. How do you get past those types of roadblocks when you are going in to work with a sales team and help really make a difference so that when they leave they're going to be different than they were when they got there?

Brook Jennings: Yes. Oh my gosh, I'm so glad you asked that, and it's so funny you say that because after a training day, there is always at least one salesperson who comes up to me who says exactly what you just said, Greg. They say, "I gotta tell you, I was really dreading today. I saw this on my calendar and was like, 'Ugh, another sales training. I have so many other things to do, but this was amazing. Like, you actually helped me," which is always the goal.

I think one thing I do a little different is I help people change their self-identity. Salespeople in the market, they do not need another sales strategy. They don't need more education. There is so much education out there. If you want to know how to sell something, there is a book for it. It has been written. It has been done. And [00:05:00] so what I want to do is, you know, when I first come in and meet a team, I don't talk about sales at all for the first couple of hours. We are just talking about the beliefs that we have and the things that we say to ourself that shape every action we have moving forward.

I always tell people that the two most powerful things you have in life, the first is self-awareness, becoming aware of something, which is what I'm trying to do. I'm trying to bring an awareness to a lot of the behaviors we have, or honestly, the behaviors we don't have that are harming us, and helping us understand where that actually comes from.

So, for example, one thing I do as a sales trainer is I learn every salesperson's name before I ever go to do a training so that when I go there, I don't need a name card. I know everybody. I know their face, I know their name, so then I can actually go up to people and say, "Hey, Greg, it's so good to meet you." They feel seen in that moment, and they feel appreciated. And so I'm putting in these extra efforts, so that these people know that, like, I see them, I care [00:06:00] about them. And then when we start the training day, you know, people will say things like, "Oh, Brook, you know, it's so crazy you were able to learn our names. I'm so bad at remembering names."

Well, you know why you're so bad at remembering names? Because you've decided that you are. There's so much of that in sales. If I'm a salesperson and I don't believe anyone in the market is really buying right now, I'm going to manifest that to be true by not asking for the sale, because whatever you believe is always going to become a self-fulfilling prophecy. And so it's things like that that I try to help people uncover. It's like, what are the beliefs you have?

You know, as salespeople, the second someone walks in your door, you make an assumption about them, and you can assume that's a buyer, and if that's what you're going to believe, your actions are going to lead you forward. If you decide within the first few seconds, "Oh, this isn't a buyer. This isn't worth my time," you're going to cut corners, and you're not going to actually take them through the sales process. So, of course I have strategies, I have all the education that I give to people, but what I really start with [00:07:00] is what are those self-beliefs that you have that are driving behaviors you're not even aware of?

Kevin Weitzel: Now, I 100% buy into what you just said. However, there's a certain thing we call, and it's just a ticking thing that happens, and you wear it on your wrist, it's mounted on the wall in most homes, is time. As time progresses with the human body, we lose that ability to remember names in either short and long-term capacity. I used to ace it. I could tell you everybody's name, I could tell you the name of their kids, their wives, their cousins if they told me their cousins' names, and the stories behind them.

However, as I've gotten older, I've lost that ability. Like, I don't even remember Greg's name sometimes. I walk in a room, I'm like, "Who is that guy? We do a podcast together. What is his..." No, I'm just kidding. No, but what do you recommend as possibly a tool that a salesperson could utilize to possibly keep notes in to give them reminders before they have appointments with people? What could they use for something like that?

Brook Jennings: Yeah. Oh, I love that question. So for me, what I do [00:08:00] is I relate the name to something familiar. So, there was one time that I was going to this training day of 45 salespeople, and I had forgotten to get the names memorized before. I didn't send name cards, and I started having heart palpitations 'cause it was a total just miss on my part. Like, squirrel. Was not thinking about it. And so I show up, and it hit me like, "Oh, my gosh, I do not know any of these people's names, so I'm going to have to just remember," as we are going around making introductions.

I still remember, y'all, where every single person was sitting. So, the very first person on the far right, her name was Courtney, and I was like, "Oh, Courtney, that was the name of my best friend in kindergarten. Brian, oh, that was the project manager I had before I started training." Like, I just related every name to something, and it really helped me remember. Like, one woman, her name was Jenny, and I was like, "Jenny, Forrest Gump."

Obviously, you know, especially you, Kevin, you're going to all these networking events, you're trying to remember a lot of people. For a salesperson, truly, if you can just remember that person's name when they say it to you in that moment, you're only remembering one to four names. It makes it less [00:09:00] hard. But a lot of times we are so focused on what we're going to say next or ask next, we're making it about us, that they say it and we didn't even hear it 'cause we weren't actually listening. So, a lot of it's just intentionality.

Greg Bray: So, beyond this idea of if I believe they're a buyer or I don't, or if I believe anybody's out there selling or not, what are some of the other roadblocks or false beliefs that you run into that get in the way of sales performance?

Brook Jennings: Yeah, so there's two types of beliefs. There are global beliefs, which is people are, life is, I am. And for people are, you can put anything, right? Buyers are, mother-in-laws are, salespeople are. That last one is what trips up a lot of salespeople, because if I am a salesperson and I have negative beliefs about salespeople, well, I'm going to not do a lot of necessary sales behaviors because there's like an identity issue there.

As a [00:10:00] world, as a society, we've been programmed to believe negative things about salespeople. There's so many, you know, sleazy salesperson jokes. We're untrustworthy, we're liars, we only care about ourselves. And so, if I'm new in sales and I don't identify with those things, I can end up self-sabotaging and not doing the strategies that I have been given by some sales trainer out in the world because of that. And so, really shifting that belief.

I always say I'm on a mission of one to change the way the world views salespeople because it truly is such a gift. When I stepped into the sales role after being a sales assistant for two years, I just remember thinking, "Oh my gosh, this is counseling," which I had always wanted to be a counselor. I've always wanted to just help people get over a lot of the challenges and issues that they have. And I thought, "This is counseling, but this is happy counseling."

You get to be a part of the first home a person will ever buy. Like, that is an absolute gift. Or you get to be a part of someone who [00:11:00] is buying their move-up home, they've been saving for years, they're growing their family. You get to be a part of that process. Are you kidding me? That is so special. And a huge part of my career was selling to the, 55-plus demographic. You know, you get to sell someone potentially the last home they'll ever buy. This is amazing.

And so, it's just such a small shift in perspective and a small shift in belief can make such a difference. And so, that's a huge part, too, of, you know, when I'm working with salespeople, it's like, what do you actually believe about salespeople? The amount of salespeople who don't even have what they do for a living on their Facebook because it's almost like they don't want people to know is so sad. And so, that's also a huge one.

And then, the other type of belief, they're called rules, which is if, then. So, it's if I do this, then I believe this is going to happen. For me, I'm a sucker for hydration, so every morning I drink water with lemon and Celtic salt. It's because I have a rule belief somewhere that says, "If first thing in the morning I drink water with lemon and Celtic [00:12:00] salt, then I'm going to feel better throughout the day."

This is really important to understand from a buyer perspective because every buyer who comes through our sales office, they have a rule belief, which is what has triggered this process. And there's a belief there that if I buy a new home, if I make XYZ decision, then my life is going to improve in whatever way.

And so, creating that awareness too, that as a salesperson, I also need to know, like, what are the beliefs I have that are driving me, but also what is the rule belief of this person in front of me that had them look us up online, get in their car, drive to me, walk inside knowing that there's going to be a spooky salesperson in there, and they made the decision to do it anyway. So, that's another just little glimpse of some beliefs.

Kevin Weitzel: Greg, I'm worried. Brook just scared the crap out of me.

Brook Jennings: Why?

Kevin Weitzel: I looked on Jibity, which is what I call ChatGPT, 'cause it's hibity jibity. I just looked on Jibity, and it said that the average person sells or moves their home every seven years. And she just said, and I'm quoting [00:13:00] Brook directly on this one, is that she said that when I'm talking to a 55 plus, and they could be buying their last home, that means I'm going to be dead by 62. I just did the basic math on a napkin. I'm going to be dead at 62. Greg, I don't know what to do.

Brook Jennings: Oh, Kevin, you're hilarious.

Greg Bray: Oh.

Kevin Weitzel: I'm sorry. I derailed.

Greg Bray: 55 plus is much closer than it used to be.

Kevin Weitzel: Yes.

Brook Jennings: Well, you know what I will say, too, that, you know, it's called the 55-plus demographic, but, I mean, I think the average age I was selling to was definitely over 70, you know, a lot of times.

Kevin Weitzel: Oh, good save. Good save, Brook.

Brook Jennings: But I hope I'm not still moving at 60. I hope I'm settled.

Greg Bray: So Brook, you talk about kind of this idea that people have about salespeople, how it's both something that as a salesperson they internalize potentially, and buyers have some of these biases when they walk in the door as well. Sometimes we see builders attack that by trying [00:14:00] to give these folks different job titles, like you're a new home consultant or other types. You see these variety of titles. It's not like, oh, this is the salesperson. Nobody really uses that title per se. Do you think those labels make a difference for any of this, or are we just trying to paint over something that's still there from those biases?

Brook Jennings: Maybe for some people out in the world it makes them feel better to think that I'm meeting with a new home counselor. You know, that was a big one, too. Or, you know, a dream home consultant. I think, for some people out there maybe. For me, someone who is in the sales world, it doesn't make a difference to me. But I love the attempt. You know, I'm such a believer of try a lot of things, keep what works. And so, if you're a builder and you feel that that makes a difference, then yeah, I think it's great.

Greg Bray: Let's go a little deeper then into this buyer journey you just mentioned. Because it was so clear that you said it starts of they look us up online, then they decide to drive, and then they meet with the scary salesperson. What are [00:15:00] the things that have changed for sales teams because of that first step being they look us up online, being such a core part now of that journey compared to maybe a few years ago when that wasn't always the case?

Brook Jennings: Well, one thing I can tell you is that in terms of the customer journey, the bar is in hell, and I hope I can say hell on this podcast. But if you have went and toured any model homes recently, the experience was probably beyond lackluster. I'm not sure what is going on because you're right, customers are starting online, which means they already have a lot of information about us. But when they come into the offices, we as the sales professionals are not giving them a certain level of care or really attention that they deserve.

Because right now, and I know y'all have heard this before and through different conversations you've had here on this podcast, and that is buyers may be less, but the ones that are looking are more serious I just find it so interesting that that's not what is [00:16:00] happening.

And so, I have told all the teams that I'm working with, one thing we're going to do is we're not going to take away the human experience of it all. If someone has called in and they have taken the initiative to set an appointment with the online team, you know they're coming, we're going to put a little sign out front that says, "Welcome, Kevin and Greg," if y'all are my appointment.

All the builders I work with have created company branded drink menus. And so, after you set an online appointment, we are sending out the drink menu saying, "Hey, what would you like? We will have it waiting for you before you arrive." And so already people are feeling, you know, just a little bit more of, wow, like this is going to be a really nice experience versus having a lot of uncertainty about what is going to happen. And so, you know, I think there has to be such a shift from builder serving questions when people first come in, because also knowing people are looking online, as a salesperson we want to know that right away.

So, when someone walks in, one of our first questions is, you know, "So have you been to our website, or is there already a home you're interested in, or how did [00:17:00] you hear about us?" What we're really doing as a salesperson, we're trying to gauge their seriousness to see if that customer is worth our time instead of creating a really beautiful experience where people feel really seen, really welcome. Because we live in a world where people feel more invisible than ever, and we're all more self-absorbed than ever.

Really asking those customer serving questions in the beginning, it just truly makes such a difference, and those are things I call really low effort, but really high impact. You know, I think that's just what we need. Things that don't take much time at all, they just take just you caring. Literally, there just needs to be a little bit more care in the world these days.

Greg Bray: The idea that someone who's taken all the time to make an appointment, come by, and meet with us, and they might not be interested in buying a house. That's just crazy, right? That they're not going to be there anymore just because they have nothing else to do on the afternoon. They must be interested in something, and you've actually made the shortlist by the time they come to see [00:18:00] you. It's not even like where they're just starting out, in my opinion at least. Does that match your experience of what you see?

Brook Jennings: Yeah. Customers in the industry who are out looking, they're not shopping with the intent to buy, they're shopping with the intent to eliminate. When they come to us, that's why when they immediately walk in, they're, you know, bombarding us with questions about what's your pricing, what's your incentive, you know, what are y'all doing for this? It's because they are overwhelmed. They have more options than ever, and so they're coming to us and they're wanting to simply check us off our list. And we make it really easy for them because we give them all the information without asking for anything in return. It's like we want them to just qualify us or disqualify us so we can just go back to, you know, whatever we were doing before. And so yeah, I think you're spot on.

Kevin Weitzel: Can I ask you a two-part question?

Brook Jennings: Please.

Kevin Weitzel: Part number one, when you walk into a room at a training session with a home builder's company, do you ever walk in and know at first glance that they're not going to be receptive to what you're [00:19:00] bringing to the table? That's part number one. Part number two is do you ever walk into the room and realize, once you're, you know, let's say 50% through your presentation or your experience with that builder, that it is the, maybe not the attendees, but the culture of the company that is not going to allow any change or anything to move the needle, if you will. Do either of those conditions happen? And could you answer those in that two-part section there?

Brook Jennings: Yes. So first part, one thing I do as soon as a builder signs my contract is I ask them to pick three salespeople for me to have a one-on-one call with. And the reason I do that is because I train salespeople never to make assumptions about what people want and need, and so I have to take my own training. And so, I will already know going into it if this team has like a skewed view of training or if they feel like they're perfect even though they're not selling.

And then I also, you know, a lot of times it's either the VP of sales and marketing, the [00:20:00] owner, or the division president that is hiring me, and so I also will do calls with, you know, the sales managers if there are more than one, and the VP of sales if they weren't part of that initial decision, and really just asking them, like, "What are you seeing? What are some of the challenges?" So then I can already have an idea going into it.

I feel like I have been very fortunate, because there's only been a couple times where I've been in a training where I've thought, "Oh, they're really not getting it." And it's only happened once or twice. It is definitely sometimes can be a culture thing. If I'm a leader, it's like I hate to accept defeat, and so if it's the salespeople's lack of performance, that can come back on me as a leader.

So, if I blame things like the market or, you know, different environmental things we have no control over, well, me as a leader, that can tend to make me feel a little bit better about myself. And so, I've definitely encountered that where it's like, "Hey, there are things we could be doing." You know, I can't accept that the reason we're not selling is due to these things that I have no control over, [00:21:00] so we have to look at the things that we can.

There's such a difference between coachability and adaptability. You know, I've definitely went into teams, you know, kind of the second part where, oh my gosh, they're so coachable. They're like, "I love this. This is amazing." But as you kinda said earlier, Kevin, you know, our memory's not always great, and so after a training day, they're only going to remember about 16% of what you've said if leadership isn't there to reinforce those things. And so, it's really important to get the leadership involved throughout that whole process.

But, you know, if they're adaptable, that means I'm going to take the new information, and then I'm going to really look at, okay, what am I currently doing and where can I fit this in, or what can I replace this with, to then see if I get a different outcome. But I think from a sales training perspective, as a trainer, you can save yourself a lot by doing those interviews before and already being fully, you know, equipped and knowing what you're going to walk into so there aren't those [00:22:00] surprises.

Greg Bray: So, you mentioned that sometimes we blame other things to protect ourselves, from that self-awareness you mentioned early on. Where's the fair line for the sales team and the marketing team to really have an honest conversation about whether the leads marketing's generating are any good or not? Or is sales just blaming poor quality leads because they can't move these people to the next step because of something else? How do we navigate that tension that sometimes arises?

Brook Jennings: Yeah. I think it's understanding that if you are in sales, you are also in marketing. Marketing is essentially creating demand before a person ever gets to you. And we have these marketing people who are working so hard, they are doing so much, that sales has absolutely no idea about.

I know me as a salesperson was absolutely clueless until, I'll never forget, this was, I think it was maybe, like, year two into selling. I'm so ashamed to admit this. I'll never forget that my VP of sales and marketing at the time, he came to [00:23:00] my office. We were going to have a one-on-one, and he saw these cards on my desk, like the information cards of a customer.

And he said, "Well, what are those?" And I was like, "Oh yeah, it was like such a great weekend. You know, I've got, like, all these people's information that I gotta put in the CRM." And he said, "Do you know how much money is sitting on your desk?" And I was like, "No." And he said, "Well, let's do the math. We're going to look at how much we spend as a company every month, and then we're going to look at how much traffic we get as a company in a month." And we did the dollar amount. I think it was $714 that the company spends in marketing to get that person in front of me, only for me to be so completely careless with that information. And it was such a light bulb moment for us.

I don't think there are any marketing people or any salespeople who have malicious intent. I truly think it's just unconscious ignorance, 'cause I know that's what it was for me. And I'm so glad that happened, though, because now with teams we do that. We're [00:24:00] like, "Okay, let's look at how much we spend in marketing versus how much traffic is coming through the door. What is that dollar amount?" And it becomes a shared language between us, you know, like me as their trainer, the marketing team, the sales team, so that everyone knows.

And I also think, too, that me as a salesperson, I never want my income to be dependent upon anyone else. And so I think that's a two-parter, too. Being aware of what marketing is doing, understanding how much that company is investing to get those people in front of you. But also, we are totally able to market as well and use our referral base and the different avenues of prospecting to help get leads in front of us, too, and to help the company in that avenue as well.

Greg Bray: So, if there's a builder listening today or a VP of sales and they want to do a better job of developing their team, what are just maybe one or two quick tips about something they could take a look at to try and improve their team's performance?

Brook Jennings: Yeah, I think it's looking at the controllables. So, [00:25:00] I can control my mindset, I can control my actions, and I can control my effort. Those are the three things I have full control over. One way I know that a team is going to be really awesome at adaptability and they're super coachable, and even though they're not selling, it's are they putting forth a ton of effort, but it's simply the wrong action?

And I share this story that happened. There was this sales guy, you know, it was after a training where we kind of dove into the three ways to grow your business, right? Your business being your model home or your sales office under the umbrella of your builder. And he said, "Brook, oh my gosh, like, I have been taking lunch consistently to this team. Like, the first Thursday of every month, I'm taking them lunch, I'm sharing about my community and what I have going on, and I have not gotten a single lead from that." So, when I'm looking at the effort, that is very high effort. So, now I have to look at, okay, what is the [00:26:00] action? So, I said, "Who are you taking this lunch to?" It was a team of lenders. It's like, okay, so it's really high effort. It's the wrong action.

And so, when you start thinking about, okay, what are the people doing and what is the amount of effort being put into it, that will really tell you, 'cause the actions and the effort have to be in alignment for success to happen. And so, as a sales trainer, that's what I'm constantly looking at. A lot of times sales leaders will say, I'll hear, "Okay, we got a call. You know, you need to be calling at least 200 people a month. You need to be calling at least 200 people a month."

But as a salesperson, I really don't have any tactics, and no one's really told me, "Okay, what do I say if they answer? What do I leave in a voicemail if they don't?" You know, and so it's like we tell people to do these actions, but then we don't really give them the tools, so then they're doing the action to check the box, and there's, like, minimal effort going into it. That's why they're not having success. And so, if you really look at what's the mindset of this person, what are the actions [00:27:00] that they're doing, and then how much effort is going into each action.

And so here's what I would do as a team. Look at everything on a 1, 5, 10 scale. Let's say networking, for example. What does a networking event at, like, the lowest level, number one, look like? Well, I go to the event, and I don't talk to anybody. Perfect. What does networking look like at a level 5? Okay, at a level 5 I'll go, but I'm only going to talk to people I already know. It's like, okay, you're deepening some relationships.

Whereas a level 10 networking event looks like I'm going to go to this event. I've already decided I'm going to leave with 20 business cards. I'm going to get the information of 20 people I've never met before. As soon as the event is over, I'm going to send personalized text messages to every single person saying, "Hey, it was so great to meet you. Look forward to working together in the future." And then I'm going to log all of that in my CRM, and then I'm going to go and connect with all of those people on socials. That is a level 10 networking.

Whereas so many [00:28:00] teams, we have these expectations for our salespeople, but we haven't really defined for them specifically and tactically what success looks like. And so, you know, I feel like it's just easy for the brain to understand a level one, level five, level 10. That way it'll give them some very specific examples so they can see where their behavior falls, but that would probably be the first thing that I would say to do that could have some really deep impact.

Kevin Weitzel: So, one could actually have, like, a report card on themselves for, let's say, an open house. So, if they have an open house, they could say, "Well, if I achieve these three things, then I've met level one. And if I've achieved these things, I've met level five. And if I've sold this house, then boom 10 is achieved, baby. And then I've got orders for the next two." Yes. But that's along the same lines, right? Because you can just facilitate that checklist into whatever that action item is.

Brook Jennings: Absolutely. Absolutely.

Greg Bray: Well, Brook, thank you so much for the time you've spent with us today. This has been a great conversation. Any last words or quick pieces of advice you'd like to leave before [00:29:00] we wrap up?

Brook Jennings: Yeah. We're going into the last little bit of the year, and so one thing I do every year is I always create a challenge for myself to do the last 90 days. You don't have to wait until January 1. So, this could be sales related, health related, just a personal goal that you have.

And so, October 1st, it's like, okay, it's the last 90 days of the year. What's something you could do to give yourself even more of an advance on January 1? Because so many other people, they hit the brakes. We got Halloween, then we got Thanksgiving, then we got Christmas. And so a lot of people check out, and I'm would ask you to check in. Check in on the last 90 and create a little challenge for yourself.

Greg Bray: Awesome.

Kevin Weitzel: Do you have, like, a podcast or any kind of information you put online?

Brook Jennings: I do all types of stuff on Instagram. Obviously, I have a website, elevateactually.com. I have an Origin Begins podcast. It's just kind of a personal passion project, but I talk about, like, challenges and, like, throw out little things all on Instagram. So, you can find me there, Brook with no E, L. Jennings.

Greg Bray: Well, [00:30:00] thank you Brook again for spending time with us today, and thank you everybody for listening to the Builder Marketing Podcast. I'm Greg Bray with Blue Tangerine.

Kevin Weitzel: And I'm Kevin Weitzel with OutHouse. Thank you.